In this conversation, host Sarah Faith sits down with Gen Z creator and marketer Anna Canfijn to unpack what actually moves the needle for brands on social media in 2025. They cover:

• Why Gen Z now judges brands first by ethics, transparency, and community impact.
• The fine line between clever trend‑jacking and cringe‑inducing meme overload.
• Three must‑have videos every brand should pin to the top of their profile.
• How to win when you don’t have a big budget (spoiler: document, don’t over‑produce).
• Why chasing virality can backfire—and what to focus on instead.
• Practical tools, posting cadence, and future trends (think Substack‑style long‑form and “low‑stim” storytelling).

Whether you run a small business or manage a marketing team, this episode gives you a no‑fluff roadmap to stronger content, tighter communities, and better conversions.

Major Takeaways

1. Ethics = Table Stakes – Gen Z assumes your product works; they follow when they trust your values.
2. Trends ≠ Strategy – One viral meme won’t save an off‑brand feed. Use trends sparingly, within clear content pillars.
3. Story Over Budget – Audiences reward authenticity and process‑based “documenting.” Expensive production is optional.
4. Three Core Videos – (a) “Start Here” brand pitch; (b) FAQ/objection‑buster; (c) Social proof compilation. Pin them.
5. Community > Virality – A steady, engaged core outperforms one‑off spikes. Viral demand can break inventory and ops.
6. Post with Purpose – Quality beats arbitrary “3‑posts‑a‑day” quotas. Aim for value, not volume.
7. Platform Fit Matters – Show up where your audience lives, but maintain a minimal presence everywhere for credibility.
8. Future Trend – A swing back to long‑form, lower‑stim content (newsletters, Substack‑style essays) that deepens brand narrative.
9. Listen & Adapt – Brands that reverse bad moves (Glossier’s balm) rebuild trust faster than those that double down.
10. Know Your Dream Buyer – Marketing to everyone is marketing to no one; build your avatar first, content second.

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Sarah Faith (00:00)
Hey everyone, thank you so much for tuning in. I'm so excited about this episode. My name is Sarah Faith and I am interviewing Anna Canfijn and we are going to be talking about social media, marketing and what every business owner needs to know on how to up level their social media game. And so I'm really excited to have Anna on. Anna, thanks for being here.

Anna (00:21)
Thanks for having me, I'm so excited. This is such a treat.

Sarah Faith (00:23)
Thank you. I

know it's so much fun. And I want to just take a moment to share a little bit about Anna. Anna has worked in marketing for years. She has done UGC content for brands. She's made viral videos. She starred actually in a mega viral video that my business partner, Tim and I created and it went viral three times across

TikTok, Instagram, and then Pinterest later all organically. And I would be remiss to say that, you know, Anna was just amazing in that, because you you were like, I really believe like you were the cherry on top of that, the success of that video. And by the way, everyone, that video alone generated...

Anna (01:01)
Thank you.

Sarah Faith (01:10)
you know, a million dollars just like from sales and stuff organically and it's still making money for that brand. And that's not to mention all of the other brands that you've worked with that stuff. So I am really excited to pick your brain. And my first question is from your perspective, you are a Gen Z creator. What makes a brand worth following on social media today?

Anna (01:34)
Okay, so I feel like something I'm seeing a ton of recently is a big emphasis on like brand ethics and morals and values. I don't know if that's just like the side of TikTok that I'm on, but I feel like my generation is probably like one of the first to demand that brands are being held to like a higher standard.

and you know, than previously. But I feel like this was definitely a conversation that was being had, but now it's a little bit more mainstream and there's more of a community that actually cares about that, you know? ⁓ But I'm seeing a lot of, yeah, just like emphasis on community outreach and ethical practices. There's been a lot of like,

Sarah Faith (02:09)
Mm-hmm.

Anna (02:18)
shall we say like TikTok drama around like sustainable quote unquote fashion brands who like aren't actually sustainable. And there's just a lot of discourse about it. So it's kind of interesting. But yeah, I also was thinking about like, and you probably know about this Sarah, but the brand Poppy around the Superbowl when they did their whole vending machine marketing campaign.

Sarah Faith (02:21)
Yeah.

Mm.

Yeah.

Anna (02:41)
and decided

to give all of those insanely excessive vending machines to influencers who like didn't really need them. There was just, it just caused, it caused such an uproar because people were like, this was such a missed opportunity for the brand to do some amazing community outreach. Like give it to a nursing home, give it to a school or like just something like go to.

Sarah Faith (02:50)
Yeah, they did it. ⁓

Anna (03:05)
soup kitchen like I don't know just do something else and so like yeah I feel like people are kind of I mean the whole influencer side of things the disenchantment with influencers is like a whole other conversation but yeah I think people are really demanding more from brands and demanding that they're actually like upholding the standards that they claim to have and I mean I think it's a great thing and whether like

Sarah Faith (03:20)
Mm.

Anna (03:29)
whether that's actually because people, know, the people who are getting angry actually care about that stuff or they just want to feel good about, yeah, I support this brand and, you know, I think it's, whether the intentions are good or not, I think it's overall a good thing just to hold, you know, these brands and businesses that you're giving your money to, to a higher standard. So yeah, I feel like that's a big, big conversation right now.

Sarah Faith (03:36)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Definitely. I couldn't agree more. And Poppy has a lot of great things that they're doing right from a branding and marketing perspective. But then I was like, how can you guys be a little tone deaf with this? I sometimes wonder if some brands do those things on purpose because they know it will cause outrage. It's like rage bait. I, by the way, I love Poppy as a their

Anna (03:56)
for sure.

you

Mmm.

Yep.

Sarah Faith (04:17)
products like they they make really delicious probiotic soda that is very low in sugar and has some fiber in it apparently not not sponsored but I definitely thought that too and I just wondered if sometimes they do those things on purpose or if just some of these brands are just so out of touch ⁓ or if they're just doing whatever they can to get

Anna (04:21)
Yes, they're very good. This is not sponsored, but...

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Sarah Faith (04:44)
influencers to talk about their product because like they're going to want an influencer who has reached to share about their little poppy vending machine in their garage versus like a homeless person who might not be able to enjoy that beverage because they can't share it on their platform because they don't even have a phone. So you gave it a you gave an example of a brand that

Anna (04:45)
Yeah.

Right. Yeah.

for sure.

Mm-hmm. Yeah, totally.

Sarah Faith (05:09)
of drop the ball and that is there a brand that you're like you know what you guys are upholding those standards that gen z demands in terms of like those values

Anna (05:21)
I really wish I could think of this one brand but kind of going back to like the clothing brand There was one company that kind of got called out. I'm so sorry that I don't know the the actual name Maybe I can tell it to you later when I look it up and then you can put it somewhere but they You know, they got called out for basically Just the the misinformation that they had regarding like the materials that they were making their

Sarah Faith (05:31)
It's okay.

Anna (05:47)
clothing products out of. And they did this whole, like they were like, you know, thank you for like holding us this higher standard. They completely switched everything, made everything better. Like just basically listened to, you know, instead of taking the criticism just as criticism, they, you know, applied that and actually changed like their whole business model and

Sarah Faith (05:48)
Mm.

Anna (06:10)
people were like, wow, thank you for actually listening to the community around you that is asking you to just be honest about what you're doing. And for them, it wasn't even that they were trying to be shady or anything. I think it was more just like they didn't know what, you know, I think they were, they were just misinformed. yeah, I'll have to.

find it and there's plenty of other brains that are out there and like they're doing that. I just can't think of any on the top of my head but yeah.

Sarah Faith (06:37)
Yeah. Yeah.

I know I love that too. Like, you know, they did the right thing. They're called out and then they're like, Okay, we'll learn from this and actually do the right thing.

so what are some common mistakes you see brands making when trying to reach a younger audience?

Anna (06:56)
Okay, found it, sorry. Yeah, I feel like TikTok, again, we're talking about TikTok as a gen Z, but they lean so heavily into just like every trend, every meme thing that kind of like pops up. And I think for some brands, it works.

You know, there's like, what comes to mind for me is like, Duolingo and like, Scrub Daddy, like their whole shtick is just being, you know, kind of silly, goofy. They're doing all the trends or they're, you know, trailblazing the trends. They're starting them. But I feel like it doesn't always translate for every other brand that's kind of, you know, trying to hop on that. And I think...

For me at least, and maybe this is just because I've kind of, you I've worked in the industry and I look at it with a little bit of a different lens, but to me, it just feels kind of tired when that's like the only type of content that you're making. ⁓ And not that marketing needs to be all serious all the time. Obviously there's a place for comedy within that, but I just feel like if your product, if your brand voice, if your tone,

Sarah Faith (07:49)
Yeah.

Anna (08:02)
everything else is a little bit more serious and then you just like kind of randomly pull you know memes and jokes out and it just feels like you know it just doesn't align and there's I think there's definitely a way to do it that's tasteful but there's certainly like you know too much of anything is not a good thing so yeah I just feel like it kind of it reminds me of like when your parents

you know, they see some sort of like internet term or slang and they're like, you know, trying to be hip and cool and it's like, just stop. Like it's not, this isn't giving what you think it's giving. Seriously, it's like, just don't, it's okay. Like nice try, but yeah.

Sarah Faith (08:33)
Mom, stop. Dad, you're embarrassing me. Yeah.

That's a good point. Yeah, because like they can almost do it to a nauseam and you're like, OK, we get it. Thank you. What else? And I think that's why I like when a brand has different marketing pillars where they they they kind of do a few like they'll do the serious, you know, and then they'll do like the educational and then they'll do the funny little trends and stuff because it is kind of fun. Like what you do to see brands like

Anna (08:48)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

you

Right.

Sarah Faith (09:11)
catch on to a trend and you're like, ha ha. Like, and it works like really well for their product or service. But then, yeah, to your point, it's like, okay, you don't have to do this for everything. And I think that's obviously on the marketing managers and stuff, but maybe to like, sometimes brands what happens is they can get like, like laser, almost like tunnel vision on if they find something that worked, let's say they went

Anna (09:12)
Yes.

Sure.

Right.

Mm-hmm.

Yes.

Mm-hmm.

Sarah Faith (09:38)
viral because of a silly video, then they're like, okay, I guess we have to just remain silly. And that's it. And it's like, sometimes. Yeah, yeah. And they're like, oh, we can only now do this. And I think that can actually limit them because sure, you might be getting viral numbers, but then like, what is that actually converting into? And like, is that the kind of customer that you want? And then also reviewing your product. So

Anna (09:42)
Right.

and that becomes their whole identity.

Right.

Mm-hmm.

Yes. Right.

Sarah Faith (10:06)
There's definitely, yeah, that's a good one. I hadn't really thought about that. What would you say is the difference between branding for a business versus like personal branding for a creator or like a founder? So like for you, you've done both because you, you know, you were in you were actually a brand ambassador for at a company for Landscape Edging. I think your official title was like a lifestyle host.

Anna (10:20)
Mm-hmm.

you

Sarah Faith (10:34)
and you were like the on camera personality for that brand. And then you also created like UGC, which is user generated content for like skin care, like a major skincare brand. And like that that content was going viral. So but it's not like you worked for that company ⁓ in the sense like you're employed by them. You were paid to make that content. So I'm just kind of curious, like

Anna (10:34)
Mm.

Mm-hmm.

Yes.

Mm-hmm.

Sarah Faith (10:59)
Was there a difference in the creation of those two?

Anna (11:03)
Yeah, so when I worked for the landscape edging company, there was, obviously, I was employed there, so obviously I was a lot more involved in brainstorming content and even editing the content, and I had a lot more control in that way.

And not that I didn't have control in my UGC creation, but with that I was more so just given content direction and then I would execute that on my own. And obviously, you know, working at the Landscape Editing Company, I was lucky enough to have a team around me so I could do a lot more rather than just being by myself and you know what that's like, you know, being a, you know, having a creative studio versus working.

Sarah Faith (11:36)
Definitely.

Anna (11:44)
by yourself, for yourself, it's like just completely different, a little bit more. I mean, there's plus sides to both, but it's just so much easier and really you can just, there's a lot less limits around what you can do. So yeah, I think that's the biggest thing is just like the lack of freedom versus a little bit more. even just having different eyes.

Sarah Faith (11:57)
Hmm.

Anna (12:10)
multiple sets of eyes on something like you know obviously mistakes are less likely things like that you know it's just it's nice to have like-minded people working with you and helping you to create something so yeah

Sarah Faith (12:20)
Totally.

Totally. You mentioned like at the landscaping company, there was obviously more resources there. And so in a way, like, you know, a bigger budget. Do you feel like there's a way for small businesses that they can also stand out online if they don't have a huge budget?

Anna (12:31)
Right.

Yeah, yeah, I think it's been proven time and time again that you don't need you don't need a big budget in order to make good content. I think obviously you guys talk about this a lot, but like just having a good story is everything and I've seen you know a lot of small business owners they'll really lean into that like customer interaction focused content. I don't know if you've also seen that but

Sarah Faith (12:46)
Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Anna (13:02)
just

kind of providing some like small scale drama like, this is how I dealt with this difficult customer or how I, you know, how I, yeah, just interacted with them. And that stuff performs really well because first of all, gives the business owners and, know, whoever's creating the content for that business gives them an opportunity to talk about their product, but it's kind of presented in this.

pretty package of like, I'm gonna tell you this situation that happened and I'm gonna give you a little bit of tea, if you will. And people love that because people are nosy, know? People love a little bit of drama. yeah, I mean I feel like just finding, even if you feel like your product isn't that unique or like, you know, I'm a sunscreen company and like I...

Sarah Faith (13:31)
Yeah. Yeah.

Anna (13:47)
There's a million other sunscreens out there. Like how do I specifically stand out? I think like going back to how you even, know, what made you start that company in the first place? Or just thinking about your day-to-day life, being a business owner and like taking people along on that journey. People, like I said, they're nosy. They want to know why, why, why, or you know, what are you doing all day? Like that's why I think those...

types of, yeah that type of content performs really well. But you don't need, it doesn't need to be flashy, it doesn't need to be, you know, there doesn't need to be a big budget behind it, it just needs to be interesting and provide some value to people. So.

Sarah Faith (14:21)
Hmm.

Totally. I always like to think you've heard me use this example so many times, but I always like to think of this creator named Brooke who started a, yep, who started a company called Brookie. I had been following her for back in her like travel blogging days, like literally like 10 years prior. And so I remember like checking in on her one time. was like, I wonder what she's up to. I really always liked her content. And I remember

Anna (14:33)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Sarah Faith (14:50)
in her travel blogging days, she would go to different bakeries and around the world. And that was always like her thing. Like she just had a major sweet tooth. And she always said like, it'd be so fun to open up my own bakery one day. Okay, how many bakeries are out there in the world? Like a million? Yeah, so many and

Anna (14:54)
you

Yeah.

million bajillion. Yeah.

Sarah Faith (15:11)
what she did was, you know, and she had a following, but like when she started her her little cookie company, Brookie, nobody showed up, no one. And I and so she started making videos on TikTok just to pass the time. And all she was doing was just she was like almost like vlogging her day. It's like, well, I have to bake the cookies anyway, so I'm just going to here's me.

Anna (15:32)
Right.

Sarah Faith (15:35)
putting them on the tray. Okay, here's me forming them into a little ball. Here's me taking them off and mixing in the chocolate chips. And then she was just posting it because she was bored. And then she has one of like the top bakeries in the world. And like that all just came from her making, I mean, it's just like her story is just crazy. And so I think about that. It's like, you know, she didn't...

Anna (15:36)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Right. Yeah.

Yeah, you go girl.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Sarah Faith (15:59)
even though she had like a following, like no one cared about it because they're like, wait a minute, you're a travel blogger. Like, what are you doing talking? Yeah. And she just was like, I am just going to document versus create my content. I think that's a big like tip for people is like, if you're like, I want to stand out and I don't know what to do, just document what you're doing.

Anna (16:02)
Mm-hmm. Right, what are you doing with cookies?

Mm-hmm.

Right. I think people

forget that because they're so deep in it that they're like, this is just what I do every day. It's boring. It's monotonous. But that's, know, people to somebody else to an outsider that's like, wait, I want to see exactly what cellophane wrappers you use for your cookies or your, know, like I want to watch you do this. I want to see every little tiny detail. Again, people are so nosy.

Sarah Faith (16:26)
I know.

Anna (16:44)
That's why, that's like the crux of social media. Like people are so interested in other people's lives. That's like in our nature. So just because you think it's not that interesting, it's like, someone out there will find it interesting. Yeah.

Sarah Faith (16:51)
Totally.

my gosh, I

learned that with the infamous landscape edging company that we both worked at because ⁓ I was in my research, you know, doing market research. I was like, what are people watching when it comes to landscape edging? And would you believe it? There are videos with millions and millions of views of people just cutting grass or like, they're just like moving stones to

Anna (17:07)
Yes.

Mm.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Right.

Sarah Faith (17:26)
create a path and I'm like, why do people watch this? like, then and so to that person, it might be boring, to other people, like I was blown away by it. Like I'm talking like 10 million views, 15 million views on cutting grass. Okay. And that's how these brands are just, they're doing it. They're documenting versus creating. I wanted to ask about like storytelling and like content creation. And I would say like,

Anna (17:29)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Right.

Yeah.

It's amazing. It's crazy.

Sarah Faith (17:51)
I'm really curious, what do you think makes a story or a video go viral, especially when it's coming from a business or a brand versus a personal creator? What would you say from a business and a brand?

Anna (17:58)
Yeah.

This is so hard. I feel like there used to be such a more clear, specific answer to this question. But as somebody who is, you know, starred in and helped create viral content, there's no exact formula. And like, wants to hear that, especially business owners and, you know, people who just want to go viral. But like, there's really nothing that you can...

due to guarantee virality. And it's crazy too, because you can spend three days working your butt off on a video, really trying to make a good piece of content, post it, and it gets 500 views maybe, and no likes. And then you spend 15 minutes making a video, and it absolutely blows.

Sarah Faith (18:48)
27.

Anna (18:58)
What is it? Blows it out of the water? Blows it out of the park? Just goes crazy and people love it. And it's like, that alone should tell you how unpredictable virality is. like, can't, you just, can't guarantee it. You can't really plan it. And it's funny, I know that you guys kind of mentioned this, but in previous, you know, for previous companies that we've done work for, the question like,

Sarah Faith (19:00)
Yeah.

Anna (19:20)
Okay, can we like go viral again? It's so funny because they think that we have, you know, we as content creators have all this power or like all this insight and we do, but not to the extent that they think. And obviously I think part of why it's so unpredictable is, you know, the algorithms are constantly changing. As we all know, they're not the same as they were this week.

Sarah Faith (19:43)
Mm-hmm.

Anna (19:43)
you know,

last week, it's it's always changing. So like, that's a big part of it, but yeah, it's just, it's so, it's so hard to pinpoint an exact formula or math equation to, you know, create virality. Obviously, you know, in my opinion, like virality is not something to strive for.

I think having a community is much more important and having steady engagement is more impressive to me than having, you know, one or two videos go viral and you know, the way that you do that is just by consistently showing up and creating good content and you know, if you have one video go viral, like not to say that that's not something that can be

Sarah Faith (20:04)
Amen.

⁓ yeah.

Anna (20:26)
or shouldn't be celebrated or like that's, you know, it's definitely an achievement, but if you can't sustain that following or, you know, the engagement that you get, then what's the point, you know? So just, I guess that doesn't even really answer the question, but like, I think focusing less on virality and just focusing more on consistently building a community around you and an audience that's continually engaging with.

Sarah Faith (20:36)
Mm.

Anna (20:49)
your posts on each platform in any way that you can, that is more valuable in my eyes than one or two viral videos. Also, there's a lot of downsides to going viral if you're not prepared for it. If your inventory isn't right, you can suffer from going viral. So like I said, it's not a bad thing.

Sarah Faith (20:52)
you

Yeah.

Anna (21:10)
It can definitely be a good thing. know it can be life-changing for so many people, but I just feel like there's a lot of pressure almost to go viral for business owners and the people who are creating content for them, but I don't think there should be. I just feel like it's like, if it happens, amazing, but if not, who cares? Maybe that sounds harsh, but that's just my take.

Sarah Faith (21:17)
Mm.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah, I know I agree. I think we've talked about that in the past, too. Like, it's not always beneficial for a brand to go viral. Tim, my business partner, who is the other host of the Brand Newt's podcast, he and I wanted to actually do a whole episode on that because it's like it's just such a big deal to so many people. And I'm like, wait, I think you have rose tinted glasses when it

Anna (21:36)
Mm-hmm.

Right.

you

Yeah.

Right.

Sarah Faith (21:57)
when it comes to that and there could be really great things that happen and then also very negative things that happen. So what would you say in terms of like storytelling? Do you think that every business has a story worth telling and how would you help pull that out of like a client or a brand in helping them tell a good story on social media?

Anna (22:01)
Absolutely.

Yeah, I think everyone does. think like going back to what I was saying earlier about like, you know, if you feel like your product isn't that exciting or that unique and you're like, I don't really have a story for this. don't like, nothing's that exciting or special about it. You're wrong, first of all, but the way that I think you can find that is just by

Sarah Faith (22:42)
Mm-hmm.

Anna (22:47)
you know, taking yourself back to like, why? Why did you create the product in the first place? Why did you start your business? And even if it's, you know, you really have to like take yourself back to like your first, you know, I hate to use my earlier example of sunscreen, but that's just like what's coming to my mind. But like, you know, say you started a sunscreen brand, right? And you're like, yeah, you know, it's sunscreen. Like I just, really...

Sarah Faith (23:03)
Go with it.

Anna (23:10)
I don't know, there's nothing that exciting about it. It protects you from the sun, but there's not really a story. Well, think back to when you were a little kid and you're at the beach and your mom comes over with a bottle of sunscreen and you're running for the hills because you don't want her to put it on because it smells weird and it leaves a sticky residue and you're just like, ew, I don't want this on my body or on my face. Was that the point where you could say, I...

I saw a need for a different kind of sunscreen, so I created a gel sunscreen that was like invisible and it actually doesn't smell like garbage. And you know, like just kind of force yourself to go back to like the roots of you know, where that seed was planted, if you will. And like really pick it apart and even if it sounds or feels kind of like you're over explaining it or you're, it's...

Sarah Faith (23:41)
Mm.

Yeah.

Anna (23:58)
It's really not and again like you might feel like you've kind of gone over that in your head a million times and you've you know you've told yourself that story or what like people want to know and it is interesting to other people so don't don't feel like you have to water it down or dumb it down like there is something special and unique about every single product that's out there as simple or as quote unquote boring.

as it might seem. So, yeah.

Sarah Faith (24:27)
Mm hmm. Yeah,

I love that example. And I like that you you're not just saying like, this is what I think, but you're actually showing that in action too, because you're right. Like so many brands think like, well, I don't know how to talk about this and that. And so I guess like we just have a boring product. It might be like boring to you in a sense, but there's someone out there who would love it, you know. And I think, too, like as that example that you used about

Anna (24:36)
Mm.

Yeah.

Right.

Sarah Faith (24:54)
the sunscreen, it's the story actually makes it way more exciting because it's I could actually think back to a time where, you you're being that's being put on you as a kid. And it's like, like, because like, I personally don't like the smell of that. And but then it's like, well.

Anna (24:58)
Mm.

Mm.

Yeah.

Sarah Faith (25:09)
it actually like melts into your skin and it like makes it like actually more glowy and it doesn't have a scent or it has like a like a citrus scent to it and you don't have to reapply it and like in the telling of the story, you're actually able to talk about the pain point of it. And that's what really like selling is. It's like people are just buying solutions.

Anna (25:12)
Mm.

Right.

Yeah.

Right.

Sarah Faith (25:33)
to problems. And so your story is actually leverage in the sales process. And yeah, I just I really like that example. It kind of goes into the next question. I'm actually going to skip over a question I had because it goes better into the next one. And that is like, what are two, maybe even three types of videos or content you think every brand should have on their social media page? So

Anna (25:37)
Yeah, totally.

Thank you.

Sarah Faith (25:57)
you could just kind of like bullet point it like you need this and this and this like what are those two or three videos?

Anna (26:00)
Mm.

Yeah,

off the top of my head, I would say you need like a start here type of video, pin it on your profile. I'm pretty sure you can pin on every social media platform now. A video answering like all of your most frequently asked questions and then a customer rating or hello, a customer rating and review.

Sarah Faith (26:09)
Yep, yep, I agree.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

You ⁓

Mmm.

Anna (26:26)
I

think those are like probably top three.

Sarah Faith (26:30)
So

for the start here video, what is the format for that for a brand? And you could use Ms. Sunscreen if you want.

Anna (26:32)
Mm.

Yeah.

Sunscreen. We love her. I feel like just if you had to, if you had 30 seconds, you know, think about like being on a shark tank. If you had 30 seconds or a minute to like pitch your product and show it in the most beautiful light possible. There it is. That's your start here video. Give it, give like the.

Sarah Faith (26:49)
Mm-hmm.

Anna (26:58)
You don't have to go too much in detail, give just insight. What is your product? What does it do? What problem does it solve for people? How does it make their lives better? What kind of person uses it just quickly? A quick, maybe 30 seconds to a minute long. And then, yeah.

Sarah Faith (27:11)
Mm.

Yeah, no, I fully agree on that. I actually say that with our clients all the time. I'm like, you need a start here video right now, like yesterday. And sometimes it's actually the start here videos that are pinned that actually do the best, you know, and there's a lot and it's not something that I think should be quickly made like, like, we filmed this in two minutes. No, like that's

Anna (27:16)
Ahem.

Yep.

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

No.

Sarah Faith (27:38)
If, cause think about it, it's like, if you could only make one video talking about that product and a little bit about the company and there's a call to action, you need to tell people where to go and what to do. And then you want to put some thought and intention into that video. And that video alone could garner, you know, so much money and revenue and leads and followership.

Anna (27:42)
Yes.

Right.

Mm-hmm.

Yeah, totally.

Sarah Faith (28:04)
We know that from firsthand experience with going viral and stuff. For the last one, because I feel like the second one is kind of self-explanatory, but for the last one, it was like customer rating and review. Can you give an example of that?

Anna (28:07)
Yes.

Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Yeah, I mean, you could go a few different avenues if you want to go like UGC style and actually use one of your customers as a kind of model in that, or even curate some sort of compilation of several clips or it could even be graphics. But just, I think now more than ever people are thriving and

buying based on customer, their peers, what are you guys saying about it? We can hear what the company, what the business is saying about their products all day long, but I think what actually pushes people to become buyers is real everyday people, their experience with the product. So yeah, I mean, you could totally do a couple different formats there, but I just feel like having that.

Sarah Faith (29:06)
Yeah.

Anna (29:13)
front and center. mean, people want to know that they're not the first person to buy your product. And it just shows so much credibility and yeah, just that it's alive and well and actually being used and people are having a good experience with it. So I think that's just really important.

Sarah Faith (29:18)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Totally, yeah. I like that. think that's, and it's such a easy, repeatable type of video too. Cause if you get 20 people talking about it, you know, as a brand or a business, you're going to be biased about your own product or service. You're going to think it's the best thing. And that holds some weight. Of course you want to be proud of it. But if another person talks about it now all of a sudden, yeah. And I,

Anna (29:35)
Yes.

Exactly.

Mm-hmm.

It means so much more.

Sarah Faith (29:53)
Yeah, I totally agree on that. So those are great answers. I do want to talk about like platform specific insight. And so where do you think businesses and brands should be showing up right now? Is it TikTok? Is it Instagram? Is it YouTube shorts? Is it all of them? Does it depend on the business or brand?

Anna (30:01)
Sure.

Hmm.

Yeah, I would personally say it depends on your demographic. Who are you talking to? What age range is your audience? Obviously, stereotypically, people over 50, they're using Facebook the most, right? So maybe hone in on Facebook if your product is geared more towards that age group.

Sarah Faith (30:17)
Okay.

Mm.

Anna (30:35)
Gen Z, TikTok, Instagram, but I tend to lean towards the belief that it never hurts to show up everywhere. It only helps grow your business. If you were at a convention and you're trying to pitch people your product in real life and people are like, oh, do you have Instagram? And you're like, oh no, I just don't really.

Sarah Faith (30:48)
Yeah.

Anna (31:03)
We're not there yet. It doesn't look the best, you know? And it's like, you might as well. Even if you, you don't have to post everywhere all the time. But I think just having some social media presence on each platform, doesn't, you know, it really doesn't hurt. yeah, I think show up where you can. Don't put so much pressure on yourself. If you don't have somebody who's like dedicated to

Sarah Faith (31:20)
Mm-hmm.

Anna (31:27)
doing all that but yeah, I tend to think it's better to show up everywhere than just one place.

Sarah Faith (31:35)
Yeah. Do you feel like businesses, there's a level of consistency that they need to have ⁓ in posting? Like how often should they be posting? Does the consistency of that still matter or should they just post when they can? Any insight on that?

Anna (31:41)
Mm.

Yeah,

I mean, I think with everything consistency reigns supreme, but I think when it comes to social media, quality is really important. So, you know, don't just post something because you're trying to check off your content calendar or, you know, meet some quota. Like actually think thoroughly and intentionally about what you're posting. Again, doesn't...

Sarah Faith (32:15)
Yeah.

Anna (32:15)
provide value, you know, is it worthwhile? it genuinely like, is the camera quality good or is it shaky? it, you know, is the lens smudged or, know, I think that whole mindset of like, you have to post every single day, every single holiday, every single, you know, it's like, I think that it's honestly rooted in like a fear of becoming irrelevant.

Sarah Faith (32:23)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Anna (32:39)
from not posting enough, but I actually think that there is such a world where you can become irrelevant from posting too much and excessive, you know, it's just like, I don't know, I feel like posting enough is enough and like just leave it at that. Don't overthink it. And you know, that amount is actually, it's definitely gonna vary for, you know, from business to business, but.

Sarah Faith (32:43)
you

Mm.

Anna (33:06)
I just, again, I think quality is so important and if, it's like it doesn't matter if you're posting every single day, if what you're posting doesn't do anything for your business. It doesn't grow your business. It's not allowing people to engage. It's not exciting anyone. It's not educating anyone. So yeah, I mean, like I said, it'll vary, but if you have something to say,

Sarah Faith (33:15)
Yeah.

Anna (33:30)
Say it. Post your content, but you don't need to overdo it. Yeah.

Sarah Faith (33:31)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah,

well, it's such good advice and very underrated and probably a hot take because a lot of social media managers or marketers would be like, no, you have to post all day every day. And it's like, you know, sometimes that could actually hurt your brand because from a from a production standpoint, it's a lot of work to make.

Anna (33:39)
Mm.

Mm-hmm.

Right.

Sarah Faith (33:59)
social media posts, whether it's graphics or short form video, long form video. And sometimes there could actually be more fruit from that same team or person taking the time to do market research. And maybe they only post like three, four times a week. And that's it versus no, you need to put out three. It's you know how like the standard is like three posts per day, like

Anna (34:01)
Right.

Mm.

Sarah Faith (34:24)
I think that that advice worked for a time and it it's not that anymore. You know, just post with intention. My my personal hell is when brands or businesses, I should say, they only post on like holidays or during a sale and then like the occasional like stock image of their product or like I'm just like. Yeah.

Anna (34:27)
Sure.

No.

Bye.

Right? It's like, what are we actually doing? Is anyone even

there? Does anyone work here? Like... Yeah. The lights are on, but no one's home. Yeah.

Sarah Faith (34:50)
I'm like, the call is coming from the inside of the house. At that point, I'd be like, yeah, I'm like, you need

to just turn off your social media because it's actually. Yeah, but it's that yeah, I mean, it's not like an indictment, but I'm like, let you know, you get what you put out, you know, and like a lot of brands, they're like, we can't figure out why we're not generating sales from social media and they have to rely so heavily on paid.

Anna (35:02)
Let's just not show up at all. Yeah.

No, no.

Right.

Sarah Faith (35:20)
paid ads instead of organic posts. And I'm like, you know what, maybe there's an investment that needs to be made. Maybe hire a marketing team, maybe hire just a singular marketer ⁓ or a UGC creator or a creative studio or an agency, you know, ⁓ and look at to like your competitors. Like if you look at their content and they're just killing it online, I guarantee you.

Anna (35:21)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Sure.

Mm-hmm.

Right.

Mm-hmm.

Sarah Faith (35:47)
there's some creative behind there who's in the trenches doing the work ⁓ or a team or a studio or an agency. ⁓ there's.

Anna (35:52)
Right.

Yeah. It's also

just like annoying to see a brand constantly pop up and you're like, my gosh, they're posting again. Like it's like, you know, so don't, you don't want to be like an annoying little fly in someone's ear. Like, Hey, I'm here all the time. It's like, Whoa, back off. Distance does actually make the heart grow fonder. So yeah.

Sarah Faith (36:03)
Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Yes.

What would you say to a brand like to use for some like go to tools or apps for creating content quickly and professionally in the event that they might have a smaller budget to start? ⁓ Or even if they have like a larger budget, but they just kind of want to keep it simple. Sometimes simple works.

Anna (36:27)
Mmm.

Yeah.

Sure.

Yeah, I mean, this is definitely more like back end kind of pre creating content. But something I learned in the industry is how important organization is and keeping all your ducks in a row. And we, our team, when we worked together, we loved Notion. And that was, I still use Notion like even just like personally. ⁓ And

Sarah Faith (36:44)
Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Mm.

Anna (37:02)
It's so great because it's like your notes app, but better. That's how I like to describe it. But they do have a free version. you know, once you get past a certain amount of storage or whatever, you might have to upgrade. But I do think it's a really great tool just for, you know, you need to have a good system in place if you want to create content. And so much of creating content is actually just the planning, the script writing, copywriting.

Sarah Faith (37:26)
Mm-hmm.

Anna (37:26)
caption,

right? Like all of it's all very, there's a lot of back end work that isn't seen. yeah, Notion is just great because it's very seamless, very easy to use. And that's definitely my favorite.

Sarah Faith (37:36)
Yeah.

Nice. Yeah, I think everybody has to find like the thing that works for them. Like Tim and I, use Notion internally in our business, but then we also use like Asana for project management and we use, I love Google Docs, Google Sheets. There's just something about it and just, Google is my girl. So yeah, it's just, you know,

Anna (37:44)
Mm-hmm.

Mmm. ⁓

I love Google Doc.

You will not catch me using Microsoft Word, I'm sorry. I love Google Talks.

Sarah Faith (38:07)
there's sometimes a lot of like played around with that to see, hey, what works? But, you know, once you find a system, use it. For the next few questions, we're going to start wrapping up. I'd love to hear about like this kind of future forward strategic insight. And these could be a little more like rapid fire answers. ⁓ What do you think is next in social media and brand storytelling in the future?

Anna (38:10)
Mm-hmm.

Totally.

Sure.

Yeah.

I love this

question. feel like...

I'm hearing, me personally anyways, I'm hearing so much buzz about like, sub stack and more kind of just like lower stimulating content. I think people are trying to, you know, lower their screen. I mean, you're still using your screen, but yeah, just have lower stimulating content. So I feel like blog writing is really gonna kind of have a new wave if there's any way you can like incorporate that into your business, whether it's like talking about, you know.

Sarah Faith (38:41)
Mm.

Anna (39:01)
the back end of your business or how your products are made, like really hire a copywriter and get them writing essays. And yeah, I just feel like that's kind of rising in popularity again and people are really interested in reading, believe it or not.

Sarah Faith (39:15)
Yeah, yeah, I think there's going to be a wave on that, too. It'll be interesting to see it play out. ⁓ You mentioned a very valuable tip earlier about how the goal isn't virality, but it's actually more about building community and like connections. So how would you say that brands can build community and not just followers? Just because you have a lot of followers, that actually does not mean that you have a community.

Anna (39:20)
Mm. Right.

Hmm. Yes.

⁓ Yes.

Yeah, I think one of the biggest ways to build community is actually just by very simply listening to your audience, listening to what they have to say. You know, it's one thing to ask for feedback, you can do that all day long, but actually applying that feedback and potentially making some changes in your business and your brand.

There's a makeup brand, Glossier, and they are like, they have a very cult-like following, if you know, you know kind of thing. But one of their best-selling products is their lip balm product. It's called Balm.com. And a few years ago, they ended up changing the formula. And do you remember this?

Sarah Faith (40:08)
Mm.

Yeah,

yeah, we I think we've even talked about this before. It was a whole thing. Yeah.

Anna (40:29)
yeah, I'm sure.

But there was, it caused so much outrage because it's like, why would you change the formula of something that is so widely loved and used and is like an everyday thing? know, it's not, it's not like a, you know, it's a lip balm. You put it on multiple times a day. And when women find a good lip product, they are loyal to it. You know, they will purchase it over and over again. So there was just so much outrage about it. And for years.

Sarah Faith (40:34)
you

Yeah.

No.

Yeah.

Anna (40:55)
every social media comment, because I follow them. I really like their perfume. But everyone, bring back the old formula of Balm.com. Please, we're begging you. And I think the reason they changed it was actually because they were trying to fit into or qualify for Sephora's clean beauty line or something. It was kind of, mean, to my understanding, it's kind of a silly reason to change something that is so...

Sarah Faith (41:13)
Yeah.

Anna (41:18)
integral to your business and your brand. But finally, like a few months ago, they brought the old formula back. And you would think that some horrible disease was cured or something like it. Like people were like, I was going to say they were cheering in the streets. They weren't, but like it was like, was the biggest, best thing ever. Like they were so happy and...

I they really, you know, when they changed the formula, they broke their community's trust and they, you know, went against like something that was very, you know, deeply rooted within the Glossier fan community. And yeah, I just feel like that restored that broken trust when they finally went back to the original formula. And it's such a simple, I mean, to my mind, it's such a simple thing.

Sarah Faith (41:49)
Yeah.

Anna (42:06)
Just listen to what people are saying, you know? I think it's more valuable, again, to have dedicated people in your arsenal and your customers who are your friends rather than, if we do this, if we go this route, we can maybe grow in this way or whatever. Yeah, I just feel like trust is so important.

Sarah Faith (42:08)
Yeah.

Anna (42:29)
just yeah, listening to what people have to say. They're taking the time out of their day to clue you in about how you could be doing better. It's like, why wouldn't you listen? And not that everyone's always right, but yeah, I just feel like it's very valuable, so.

Sarah Faith (42:38)
Definitely. Yeah.

Yeah, yeah, you want to value your customers and what and their input because they're the ones that are make you have a business and are paying for your products and services. So it's such. Exactly. What advice would you give to a business that feels like, OK, this is all great advice, Anna. Thank you. But we feel like it's just too late to get good or to.

Anna (42:47)
Right.

Right.

Yeah, they gave you that platform in the first place.

Yeah.

Mmm.

Sarah Faith (43:10)
grow a following or build a community on social media.

Anna (43:13)
Sure. I never think it's too late for anything. You can always start. But if you're really lost, hire somebody. Hire a creative studio like Stumpin' Root. Or hire some creative individuals. There are so many people who are passionate about branding and marketing. if you give them that opportunity too, they will take care of that for you.

Sarah Faith (43:25)
Yeah.

You

Mm-hmm.

Yeah.

Anna (43:41)
what's the word? Outsource. Outsource, baby, outsource.

Sarah Faith (43:43)
Outsource.

Outsource. Yeah. But you know, if you don't have to hire, you know, like it doesn't have to be the most expensive thing either. You know, there's plenty of people who could help retool and like, I think a better word is like reimagine your business and just getting a fresh set of eyes on it can be so valuable, especially if there's like a difference in age, you know, like sometimes

Anna (43:45)
Yeah.

No.

Mm-hmm.

Absolutely. Yeah.

you

Sarah Faith (44:09)
people in their like 20s and 30s, they will work with companies who are like 50 and 60 year olds. And they're like, hey, we grew up with social media. Like we know this better than anyone. So hire us, hire someone like Anna. She will create great content for you. So I would love as a final question for you to answer, what's one thing that you wish every business owner?

Anna (44:12)
Right.

Mm-hmm.

Right. Yeah.

Mm.

Sarah Faith (44:36)
new about creating content that actually connects and then converts.

Anna (44:41)
Yeah, I think the biggest thing, and know you, Sarah and Tim, you guys talk about this so much, but nail down your audience. Figure out who you're talking to before you do anything else, truly. And if you've already started, that's okay, but take a step back and really figure out who am I talking to? Who am I, who is my, who's my buyer? Who is my most...

What is the word? My brain is failing me. My... not perspective. Who's my... Help me out, Sarah. Perceived?

Sarah Faith (45:08)
Perceived, who's

my most perspective person? Or who's most likely to buy it? It's okay.

Anna (45:15)
No.

No! my gosh, I'm so sorry. it's

okay. Target, your target buyer, right? Is that? Target customer, your dream buyer. Yes, yeah, okay.

Sarah Faith (45:23)
okay. Yeah, yeah. Your dream. Yeah, I call it your dream

client avatar, but like, yeah, your target buyers. So you're, yeah, you're saying who is your most target buyer that dream client avatar, the person who's most likely to buy your product?

Anna (45:31)
your dream client, your, yeah, okay.

Yes. Yes.

Yeah. Nail down your dream client, your target buyer, figure out who you're talking to, because that will inform all of your other decisions. Everything that you do should be centered around that. the content that you create, the words that you use in your copywriting, it...

Sarah Faith (45:54)
Mm.

Anna (46:05)
needs to be centered around them because you want it to resonate with people, right? And the only way to do that is to fully understand them inside and out. So like, I remember we, when we worked together, we wrote down just like these little profiles for people, kind of made up these characters, if you will, and created, you know, their entire lifestyle. Who are they?

Sarah Faith (46:21)
Yeah.

Anna (46:26)
What do they do for work? How much money are they making? What kind of clothes do they wear? Do they have kids? Are they empty nesters? Really just go in on that, pick them apart, and kind of create this little avatar in your head of who are you talking to? Because marketing to everyone is marketing to no one. So you can't just talk to the void and expect for people to resonate with your content. It's not gonna happen.

So yeah, I think that's

Sarah Faith (46:54)
Yeah.

Anna (46:55)
the biggest thing, for sure.

Sarah Faith (46:56)
To your point, I think a big mistake that business owners make is they think that their product is for everyone. And it's not, it's not, there's always going to be someone who says, no, I don't want it. That's not for me. I don't care about that. And then there's going to be someone who's like, this is my favorite thing in the world. And people can convert, you know, but or like evolve in

Anna (47:01)
Mm.

It's not. Don't fool yourself.

Mm-hmm.

Right.

Sure.

Sarah Faith (47:22)
at first being like a hater. And then they're like, this is the best thing ever. But, you know, what you're saying is, to get more buyers, you have to get your buyer, you have to understand who they are. And in a way, you're actually making content not for the masses, you're just making it for that one person. And that, yeah, and then it and then it allows you to create with more freedom and ⁓

Anna (47:24)
Yes.

Mm-hmm.

Right. It takes so much of the pressure off.

Mm-hmm.

Sarah Faith (47:50)
hopefully connect and convert. So Anna, I just wanted to say thank you so much for doing this with me. I really I learned a lot. I was like, yeah, that's a good point. yeah. I'll have to use that in our in our work with our clients. But I really appreciate you. And we are Stump and Root. And anyone listening, can head to our website at www.stumpandroot.co to check out our branding and design studio.

Anna (47:52)
Yes, absolutely.

Of course. Thank you. Oh, I'm glad to hear it. Oh, thank you.

Sarah Faith (48:17)
We appreciate you listening, watching wherever you are. And again, Anna, thank you so much. This was definitely a treat and an honor.

Anna (48:24)
Of course.

Thanks for having me.

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